SimonWeir
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Mark, both sound great. Remember B&O owners expectations are ridiculously high… but we are financially and time heavily invested so our systems should sound great and when you hear other systems you should be able in my opinion to hear the difference between B&O and other manufacturers.
Back to back between the two sound processing, I get the personal sense that TrueImage has slightly more envelopment than Direct and it is more forgiving on seating sweet spot as some channels seem to be blended across multiple speakers, nothing overtly obvious and TrueImage is my default for all viewing both Film & Music except for UHD Blu-Ray because I know all the channel information is coming through uncompressed.
The clear sound difference in using Direct is actually the silence from speakers when not receiving a source which is odd for normal viewing, but to me is the most accurate reproduction of the source, hence why I use for Blu-Ray and hope to do for all Atmos input when I can confirm that tones are correctly being sent to the correct assigned speakers.
I have offered John (previously Manchester B&O) and Ian (Manager of B&O Manchester) plus B&O UK leadership / technical to come and film at my house because it is only in actual homes with unique layout limitations will the developers / sound engineers get feedback other than in their controlled conditions / their own home testing of room compensation and what is typical usage, e.g. I bet no one opens and closes as frequently throughout the day and has the TV open at 60 degrees on the automated wall bracket for hours each evening as I do, and have needed to have the TV re-levelled as often as I have, because the weight on the bracket + TV + Theatre over time affect the 13 bolts anchoring the Theatre so the whole setup starts to sag on the corner not anchored to the wall by at least 2cm which is very noticeable when watching programmes that the screen in not level. Plus I get the sense owners are quicker to identify bugs but we struggle to convey to Head Office via the small message box what we hear / are experiencing.
Follow up… a response to my similar post from the Apple Community
“The Apple TV 4K box will output Dolby Atmos in Dolby MAT format, uncompressed like PCM, with a sub-stream that represents the object based mix, to audio devices that support this. Content from commercial online streaming provider apps do not get stripped of Atmos meta data. In fact, it is very similar to Dolby Digital Plus with Atmos, as that is how it streams to the device.”
“content on the Apple TV app on is equal quality to the Apple TV 4K box, unless your audio system supports Dolby Digital Plus with Atmos, but not Dolby MAT (rare these days).”
From the spec sheet on the B&O website I see the Theatre supports Dolby MAT, so why if the above is the case does the B&O App not show Dolby Atmos via Dolby MAT and instead shows Dolby Atmos via PCM?
Hoping Geoff Martin may comment because I think I am left with an answer that the sound direct into the Theatre from a latest Apple TV box should be in Dolby MAT and be better than via the App into the Theatre but then why does TrueImage sound different as all settings are at their factory defaults and I have the correct number of speakers, so in practice should be behaving as Direct.
When the text tone disc arrives I will post my findings.
This is a real nerdy issue as the sound is incredible… I just need peace of mind to know everything is working as intended, and go back to enjoying films instead of walking round with my ear to each speaker and my wife thinking I am going insane! ?
Thanks SandyB, for clarity on your system. I am unsure about barbar, but all of my devices are straight into the Theatre using HDMI 1 & 2 (Sky Q and Apple TV A2843 – 2022 version with Ethernet) and 3 for the eARC using supplied B&O HDMI. On the LG, only using HDMI 3 for the eARC and 4 for the Panasonic UB820 UHD Blu-ray. No matrix for me. Everything can play highest definition ie DV and on the Sky 10 bit HDR HLG. Just played around with the HDMIs and it does not matter whether the Apple TV is connected into the Theatre or direct into the LG I get DV and 4:4:4. Also swapped the Apple TV box for my old 2017 device and same can get DV whether connected into the Theatre or LG. PS on latest 2.5.3 (141) Theatre software.
Edit… I missed you are sending from the other side of the room via HDR Balun, SandyB is on the money, probably not cables but the HDMI extender and it’s setting.
It seems you may have the same issue I did resolved with a cable swap. Makes no sense but it solved for me… seems the Theatre and LG and ATV are sensitive to some HDMIs.
I still get the occasional digital copy message on Disney Plus app on the ATV but a quick restart clears that.
At the same time, ask the installers to run a spare hdmi as well for future proofing, at least it is fed through the bracket in case you buy another device. I also have a spare PUC lead run through as they are known to fail. Both spare leads are hidden behind the port cover at the Theatre end and in my device cabinet at the other end.
I have a Theatre + LG G2 65” on motorised wall bracket (trading in for a G3 65” coming 30th May) with latest AppleTV 2022 unit (did have a 2017 device before when the Theatre first arrived last October and my comments the same) Vision works … I have the ATV going into the Theatre, so I can use the PUC. I also have a Sky Q going into the Theatre, Dolby Vision works with PUC.
Bang Olufsen Manchester did need to change all my HDMI cables despite the cable stating HDMI 2.0 and worked when they installed on previous Eclipse but the Sky Q would not get 10 bit and the ATV did not offer 4:4:4, after a HDMI cable swap (again 2.0 from same manufacturer), now all working.
Additionally I have a Panasonic UB820 going into the TV in HDMI 4 and Vision works.
I suggest trying a different HDMI socket on the LG first, and 2nd try a new HDMI cable. Also recommend everything going into the Theatre so you can use the BeoRemote One with PUC.
I cannot get the BeoRemote to use HDMI CEC for anything direct into the LG. If you have a Theatre seems a shame to me in my opinion to have to use other remotes.
I had confirmed via Support that the Theatre does not support CEC. Shame as I expected my BeoRemote One to control all devices connected to either the Theatre or the LG G2. Strangely if you revert to the LG remote any devices connected to the TV directly are controllable via CEC. I have considered removing my HDMIs from the Theatre and plug in the TV and bin off the BeoRemote and just use the LG remote plus App.
Adding some counter balance… I used my existing BeoRemote One from my Eclipse and have been using with my BeoSound Theatre since October, and I cannot recall when I changed the batteries, at least a year maybe. I don’t use alkaline but Energizer Ultimate Lithium. My problem with my BR1 was the screen lifting off… had three different plastic control inserts sent direct from Denmark, arranged by Manchester B&O; assumed a dodgy batch. Current remote is holding, but I do press it tight by the screen weekly, to ensure adhesion.
I am also running 5.3.51127, updated 26/10/22. Come to think of it, the sound drop out is happening more frequently with this latest software, but still for me only circa once a month. Mine was installed over 3 years ago, and for the most part it has been bulletproof. It is overkill for the Kitchen but I love it. It was one of the first in the country, like my Theatre… I am a sucker for buying on launch day B&Os products.
I experience the same issue on my BeoSound Stage and LG C9, but less frequently. I find it happens on both the connected Sky Q mini box, and also Apple TV 4K, about once a month.
Like you I do not use a BeoRemote but the LG OEM remote, and control the devices via CEC. Only difference is all devices are wired to an Ethernet switch.
I have found the quickest way to recover is open the LG settings > go to the Sound menu > select internal speakers… you now hear the panels speakers > then reselect the eARC option… Stage is reconnected.
There is no reason I can root cause as to why the occasional drop in sound.
I feel there has been little in the way of software updates, so I work on the basis the Stage will be either unsupported or discontinued in the future. Which if it transpires is the case will be a real shame as it is a superb Soundbar and speaker for the money.
I only wish B&O added WiSA / wired connections as for many this is all the Soundbar they will ever need and actually imo better than the Theatre (£4£) when you factor in the cost difference, and few require the Listening Positions as not on a motorised wall bracket or movement stand, and Joe Public have it flat on their wall. PUCs not required as the CEC works perfectly. This is where the Stage outperforms the Theatre, as the Theatre doesn’t support CEC.
I am not on the Beta programme. However I received the update in my app this evening. I am in the UK. My Theatre was installed on the 24th October. I will install v2.5.3 tomorrow as by coincidence my LG G2 has also downloaded new software, and will apply the next time I turn on.
Sandyb re your TSG question #14715
When you are editing a listening position, select ‘Advanced Setting’ off the 3 dots; accept the warning notice and then you can assign/remove all speakers to any role. When I watch a UHD Blu-ray and are using 3 sets of BL17s (FL, FR, SL, SR, BL, BR) with a BL19. I have the Theatre FL, FR both as FC, with the Centre. I use the Theatre Up speakers as Left + Right Front Height, and the Theatre Side speakers as Left + Right Surround Height. This delivers an excellent 7.1.4 setup. With the BL17’s power having the Theatres main speakers all as the Centre means I never think the speech is underwhelming or I need to turn the volume up. I recommend you load up two listening positions 1 with just the Centre as the Centre and the other using the FL + FR also as the Centre and see what you prefer.
Scroll down. If you are not using the FL & FR of the Theatre you can try the virtual wide & elevated.
Please add a snapshot of your listening position.
You may find that not all speakers are assigned a role. I am thinking the mic setup has assigned the BL90 as FL & FR, the BL3 as SL & SR. Also the Theatre is only using the CF and Front Left & Right Height… which will give you 5.0.2 the rest are not turned on.
If you go into the advance menu you can use the Side Speakers as Surround Height to give you 5.0.4. Or turn on the Front Theatre to virtual. Both sound excellent and are much more immersive. Purest will say the side speakers should not be assigned height roles but to my ears having a x.x.4 vs a x.x.2 is more realistic. My normal TV viewing is 5.1.4 (Theatre plus a pair of BL17s) and for movies I bring in my rear speakers (another set of BL17s) to get 7.1.4
Re Apple TV, remember it outputs via LPCM as the codec. I use the latest 2022 model, and Atmos is shown in the channel allocation whatever number of speakers you have assigned, as long as you are playing from any of the Apps eg. Netflix, Prime, Disney, Apple Music etc. I only get codec Dolby TrueHD when I play a UHD Blu-ray, on my connected Panasonic UB820.
I have ATV boxes on both my TVs (connected to LG G2 and BeoSound Theatre, as well as to a LG C9 and BeoSound Stage). When I got my Theatre I upgraded my ATV 4K to the 2022 model and it is quicker than the older 4K box. As MM has said, it is how you use the device. I have them all synchronised so I can start a movie in the Kitchen and finish in the Lounge. The real win with the Theatre for me is the quality of Apple Music, especially as most of the new music is in Atmos. In fact I have created a new music group of 7.1.4 as an alternative to my normal music of 4.1 using 4 x BL17 + BL19, as I find using the Theatre as well makes the sound so much more engaging. For the money (£149.00 – £169.00) a new APT 4K 2022 is a no regret choice. I recommend the Lan variant. If only because every Apple reviewer has said this is better than their TV app, and I can say mine using PUC and with the box integration is part of how I like to live in my home, plus with the A15 chip and HDMI 2.1 and all the onboard memory it must be more capable in the decoding than a download app.
Hdmi needs to go into the Theatre. Also set the PUC to “Apple TV 4”. The BeoRemote / Theatre combo removes the inbuilt TV hdmi-cec capabilities so you cannot control any devices connected to the TV. I questioned this with support because you can get it to work on the Stage in the LG device manager.
If you use your OEM TV remote any devices connected via hdmi direct into the TV which are enabled for hdmi-cec will work through the TV’s OEM remote. I have considered re wiring my Theatre and put everything direct into my LG G2 and use the LG’s OEM remote and bin off the BeoRemote.
This is what I sent to Support…
I have a Panasonic DP-UB820 connected to the LG G2 not the Theatre. Is there a way to enable hdmi-cec so the Beoremote One can operate it as I am using the PUCs for my Sky Q and Apple TV 4K (2022). I found this video on the Beosound Stage support website will this work for the Theatre?
https://support.bang-olufsen.com/hc/en-us/articles/360041729011
Their response…
We would like to inform you our Beoremote One won’t be able to work along the device you are looking forward to control, not even with the HDMI-CEC options.
Short version = stop the hating on 17s on WiSA. It is your surroundings not the speaker reception than causes interference.
Long version = I have used WiSA with BL17s for 6 years… on Avant 55 Gen 1, Eclipse 55 Gen 1, Eclipse 55 Gen 2 and now Theatre with G2 65. The 17s are rock solid in their connection. I have 3 sets of 17s connected. My shortest distance to a 17 is 0.6m and my furthest is 6.4m (in another room). The connection quality is better since my dealer arrange for all to have the latest software update. It is my BL19 that was problematic on WiSA and had this wired, but in truth I prefer WiSA because always on, rather than me looking each time I change listening position to see if the green light appears.
Does anyone recall what the specific settings for a Sport sound preset are?
This preset was a default option with the Eclipse but not for the Theatre and Stage. I am looking to recreate and save as a user created sound mode, for my Theatre.
I did feel this was a great preset for Football and F1, and with the World Cup, felt I wanted to hear more of the stands and the echo of the stadium.
I am after the specific numbers for: frequency tilt, sound enhancement, speech enhancement plus the bass management, compression etc, as well as surround, height, stage width and envelopment, so I may copy these.
Thank you in advance.
*** update – started a separate post directed at Eclipse/Harmony owners ****
I have a Panasonic DP-UB820EB and when I was using my Eclipse with PUC I had it set to the Panasonic Generic Blu-ray. Now using the Theatre my Apple TV 4K (2022) & Sky Q use the PUCs. My 820 goes into my LG G2 directly in hdmi 1 not the Theatre; and I need to use the LG remote for the hdmi-cec, or the 820s own remote, as the BR1 does not to my knowledge do cec.
FYI I use my Nintendo Switch as the other hdmi into the Theatre. My feeling is the PUCs are best saved for the devices I use most often.
Of note for the Apple TV 4K (2022) the only PUC that works in the long list is an old “Apple TV 4”. Strange because there is a new Apple TV 4 + 4K but this does nothing.
I have the Theatre with BL17s as the surrounds and a BL19. I think the mic calibration favours the Theatre’s bass too much and so for all listening positions I have increased the BL19 by +5. You can tell the difference with the BL19 on or off and I prefer on… the bass is more complete.
All this being said I already had the BL19, but if I didn’t I would not buy one in at full retail of £3,500.00. If you can source a second hand one in great condition I do not think there is any scenario where it wouldn’t add to your listening to music/watching a movie pleasure.
IMO, the bass in the Theatre is impressive, and is not a compromise. The 2 x 100 watt is more than most people will ever want… but a dedicated sub with all that extra 2 x 160 watt class D woofer, if you can afford it, go for it, but remember with the new rebalancing bass management it will not be driven like any previous setup, and it has taken me a few weeks to prefer the Theatre over the Eclipse for sound. For TV ease the Theatre is not as accomplished as the Eclipse.
I have raised with support a bug if you are too quick with the BeoRemote using PUC A (say to control the Sky Q) it sends a signal to PUC B which in my case is Apple TV 4K 2017, which for a second disconnects HDMI 2, a message comes up saying Theatre disconnected, connected by WiSA & Wired speakers flash red. A moment later it all reconnects and changes source to the Apple TV. But in doing so in the app, it thinks you have disconnected power so need to recalibrate in my case the motorised wall bracket. The recalibration is strictly not needed as it does retain all settings, however to remove the calibration icon in the app you need to go through with it. Support have said they cannot help remotely and to contact my dealer. I have worked out to have patience… plus ordered the new Apple TV 4K 2022 with HLG HDR support as only £169.00 and my current Apple TV is 5 years old and doesn’t have all the resolutions my LG G2 65” can support.
