Sia43
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Hi again,
Based on the received advice in this post, I’ve made the below schematic for a network I hope could work for me. I, however, have four questions that I would be grateful if can be answered.
1- Is the mentioned “switch” in the NL/ML user manual something similar to the one in the schematic?
2- What type of media server can be recommended in this case (I prefer simple, minimalistic, great design solutions)
3- In another post, I asked for a solution for the potential delay in room 2 in the schematic between BL-11 and BL-levels. Can a delay box (see schematic) possibly solve this problem?
4- Will my suggested cabling work?
MM, thanks again for valuable advice. I’ve just purchased an NL/ML converter and I was thinking if I should also get a Beolink delay box. From your response on another post (BS-Essence + BV14) I understand that the delay box cannot solve delay issues for the NL- part of my network but would a delay-box be necessary for the ML part (BL-2000s and NL/ML converter)? Or may be. I should ask, Will there be any internal delays within the ML part of the network?
MM, thanks for your answer and the link. I assume then that the function isn’t compatible with Mozart based products!
MM, in the picture you’ve attached on Essence settings, there is a setting called “Lydsynkronisering”. Do you know if the setting is for removing potential audio delays with other B&O products?
I had a dilemma about a month ago, purchasing new Beoosunds to pair. Although the BS-Balance has a more powerful sound, I ended up buying a pair of BS levels due to their form factor. Balance looks a bit strange, and although the lower half looks interesting, the upper half looks unfinished (or un-balanced, … ironically). Maybe it would have looked better if the top could be rounded up like the bottom of BL-28s. Regardless of the looks, the new colour is, in my opinion, not a very good one, probably worse than any other version of the speaker.
My apologies for being slow, but if I use the network link socket on the NL/ML converter (see picture), where does the other cable end go to? To the ethernet socket of one of the Beosounds, Or does NL/ML already captures the NL signals wirelessly?
Thanks again MM, for the information. It would, of course, be more efficient not to use an Essence in this network. However, how would the NL/Ml converter receive its signals from the NL network? None of the Beosounds has line-out or AUX, you see!
Many thank MM for the detailed answer. Since this is my first attempt at building a network of devices, I would be genuinely grateful for a few clarifications.
1- In alternative 1, would I need an ML/NL converter? I mean, the B&O should, in that case, only recognise the Essence and not BL-2000 per sig.
2- Am I understanding you correctly that ML/NL is needed if I want to daisy chain the BL-2000s? If so, will the B&O app recognise each individual Beolab as a unique device, or will they act collectively?
Many thanks in advance
Thanks Guy; I didn’t see that you added the part numbers the first time. Thanks again
Design, sound and price are subjective and vary among us, which leaves us functionality. I think products with poor functionality are the ones with the least value. Many here suggest BS-Emerge is a failure, yet it has an excellent design and functions pretty well, although a bit pricy. The same goes for Beosound Edge; it is unusual and sounds different, but it works, so I wouldn’t suggest it is a failure. On the other hand majority of B&O TVs (from their early LCD panels and onwards) feels extremely overpriced, have many bugs, and are not exceptional in any other way than their design for which they come with a price tag that is 7-8 times higher than similar technologies. That is not expensive, it is simply madness to pay around 10,000 Euro or more extra for an LG TV combined with Beosound Stage, worth less than 2,500 pounds (especially when you can put together them yourself, minus the sleek positioning of the speaker). I understand that as a small company it costs a lot to compete with big brands such as LG or Samsung. I believe they shouldn’t. Instead, they should focus on what they are good at, which is sound and design and to certain degree integration (if they can manage to handle their software issues). I can’t wait to see the new Beosound Theater for example, which, according to rumours, is moving in that direction. So B&O TVs are the least valuable products to me.
This youtube video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ivTnjK5mLV0) shows a product that seems similar to what you are planning to do. It might be small enough to be built inside the Beolab 2 (just guessing).
It seems like the trigger is going on as soon as a line signal is received and turns itself off after 6 minutes with no signal. I wanted to buy two of these for my Beolab 2000s, but unfortunately, the provided eBay link doesn’t seem to work.
In case you find the product, please let e know.
Thanks, Steve and Guy, for your replies.
Yes, I believe experimenting is probably the easiest way (if someone hasn’t done it already).
The idea came to me at work. I have one of these slim notebook computers with only two USB-C connections, and one of them is also serving as a power supply. I have, however, connected ethernet, HDMI, a USB typ3 for the keyboard and mouse, and a charging cable for my iPhone through one of the all-in-one hub solutions, and it still has a card reader and a few additional empty USB connectors left. All of these are connected to my computer with a single USB-C cable. So a USB-C cable shouldn’t have any problem transferring power, ethernet and line signal.
I sent an email to B&O, and they told me that the USB-C on BS-Level and BS-Emerge are for powering only, but I don’t know about Balance or any other BS speakers.
The question is why B&O don’t provide a much more elegant solution, provide easier connectivity for the customers and save space on the device, which would make it easier for them to design as well?
Anyways, I will order two combined ethernet+USB-C and two line-in + USB-C cables (see the picture) and will update the post once I’ve managed to test my hypothesis.
However, if anyone has already tested this, it would be great to hear about your experiment.
Thanks, Stan, for the information, which is truly helpful.
I’m, of course, not a technician and know very little about electronics and digital sound processing, but somehow it seems to me that B&O should have considered the delay problem and provided the same fix as they offer in their more recent TVs and for their Beosound wifi speakers and BS-Core, of course. It seems like all newer Beolabs also suffer from delays, and it sounds like a mistake that anyone who wants to listen to music has to listen to it through their B&O TV, or they will have a problem with delays.
Also, you wrote, “Of course, if your Levels have GVA, then they will not distribute the line-in audio”. Why would BS-Level with GVA not distribute the line-in audio? I thought voice assistance was just a function of Google services, but what has it to do with the line-in signal?
Thank MM for clarification. I believe I now understand your points much better.
I understand that the presence of individual DSPs in BS-Levels and their absence in BL11 may cause a delay due to different processing times; besides what you already mentioned about the portion of singles that should have been crossed over to BL-11 cross-over while the Levels will keep playing them too. A delay there would indeed cause an echo and disturb the sound image.
Theoretically, wouldn’t it be better if I fed the BL-Levels (line in) from BL11’s PL-out (left and right)? This way, I might be able to ensure that the Levels don’t get the frequencies that BL11 intends to play. However, it might be possible that the BS-Levels DSP will decide to add those signals on its own (can it?)
Also, I’m not sure if it is only me or not, but it seems like there is a market potential for an updated BS-core with its own DSP and delay-management processor (like the one is modern B&O TVs) that could connect to any Beloab or Beosound speaker, or perhaps that is what they are trying to do with the Beosound Theater!
I also came to think about the 2+1 function in the Beolab transmitter in cases where someone (like me) wants to add a subwoofer to a pair of speakers. Does anyone knows if the 2+1 in BL-transmitter provides a simple crossover function, or is there a more sophisticated DSP behind it?
Thanks, Trackebo, for providing detailed information about the delay sources and Stan for confirming the functionality with the composite BS-Core + BS-Level environment. Now I need to get a Beosound core and keep my fingers crossed.
Thank you both Hjort and Millemissen,
I’m getting a bit confused, So as a general question, if I for example stream music using B&O-app from a BS-core that is connected to Beolab 11, can BS-Levels be joined without delay? If there will be a delay in such a system, what would it be caused by? After all they are supposedly using the same sound source, or are they?
Thank you for your response. I’m, of course, aware that Beosound level and Beolab 11 are from different generations and functionalities, but I also need to mention three aspects here that I believe play a role:
1- Bang & Olufsen’s philosophy encourages integration, where Masterlink, network link and older versions of the links are good examples and mixing products from different generations has never been a problem from what I understand
2- Sound doesn’t discriminate between old and new designs but is perceived by us as listeners. BS-level, for example, cannot reproduce the lowest signals with proper pressure due to its physical form, so adding a range of missing signals could potentially improve it. You are correct about the devices being balanced individually but within their physical capacities. It is clear, for example, that a three-way speaker sounds fuller than a two-way speaker as it covers the range of the sounds better/less compromised.
3- Finally, the perception of sound depends on the individual listener, which is why everyone in this forum suggests that we should listen to the speakers before buying. After listening to my BS levels, I feel that BL11 could improve the sound image (for my taste)
Having all of this said, I do, of course, respect your view, while that is not what I asked. I wondered which technical solution could provide the best and most seamless solution to combine the speakers from a purely technical perspective.
